Episode 38 — transcript

He Makes Food Look So Good You Can Taste It Through a Screen | Paul Otien aka Paushinski. Ep. 38

This transcript is generated automatically by YouTube and has not been checked by a person. It misspells names and mishears words, particularly around Kenyan English and company names, so read it as a guide to the conversation rather than a quotable record. Each timestamp opens the video at that moment.

0:01 [Music] Greetings ladies and gentlemen and welcome to episode 38 of the African Do podcast. Today we venture into the world back in the creative economy space and we have a I think it's right to call him legendary photographer Paul Oteno aka Pchinski. P welcome to the African do podcast. Thank you so much. That legendary.
No, own it. Own it, man.
I'm I'm I'm going to own it.
You take it. Take it, man. I've given it to you now. You can you can run with it. Even though the legendary may be coming, take it for now. Good.
Grab it.
Welcome to the African Do podcast.
So, P, let's start maybe uh back. You know, um you're a photographer. You make your living out of photographer. You dabble in a few other things, social justice and all that. and even uh writing or you're a playwright and so on. But where do you start? What what where do you uh post uh let's say high school where do you find yourself and where does the journey begin?

1:12
Oh so post high school I when I was in high school I thought I'd do medicine.
Uhhuh. Uh yeah I thought I'd do medicine. Um uh I think cuz my folks my dad specifically had convinced me that I can be a doctor.
Yes.
Uh and you know I had I had uh those jungle nicknames for what you're about to be.
Yes. Yes. Yes.
Doctor.
And you liked it.
Yeah. But um but the process of doing medicine didn't uh uh didn't quite go the way I thought I would go. So I I remember I went back home and I told my mom uh I think I want to do I want to do coms.
Mhm.
Actually I didn't tell I think I want to do com. I just told her I don't think I want to do medicine. And she was like what? So what do we do? How do we

1:59
we are Africans. How do we handle this? Yeah.
You have to do something.
Yeah.
So I she said you okay you go find uh a couple of uh things you think you might want to do and then let's see what goes on. Then I was uh I was uh I was at Old Saints Cathedral. I was in the youth group and I was a dancer with vessels of honor. Uh and uh my friends were in da
and it was it was just around August uh when when uh usually August is when guys would go to campus. Yes.
Yeah. So you get your results I think early in the year you have maybe about 6 months window if you want to change if you want to move things. And then in in August is when most first years would ideally open.
Yeah.
So I went I got the paperwork. I went to Valley Road. I I paid 2,000 B for the paperwork. I came back home with them. My mom signed.

2:51
I went to church cuz uh Da required uh a clergy to sign and say yes this is a Christian. We know him belongs to this church.
Uh and we approve.
Yes.
So that's how I I ended up in D. I did uh communication arts uh and then I I left uh I met a couple of guys uh in DA who would open the doors that would be for me uh
uh in the next maybe couple of years. Yeah. So that's how that's how I ended.
So communication arts is is general. It covers all forms of journalism. It covers you know PR and coms. But now postgraduation, how do you find yourself leaning towards the path of photography?
Oh yeah. So when I when I was in in campus, I thought I will do um I thought I will do uh mainstream news. That's that's what I wanted and you know of course DA is known for you know mainstream

3:53
communications program. Yeah. uh but with with my interactions of with creatives uh and then while I was in day side I didn't identify as a creative uh so when I was uh when I was there then I met uh I saw what guys will do in terms of creative guys who will do graphics and it will be cool
uh guys who will do photography uh you know with uh film
uh some analog stuff and then guys who will do film you know so it was really exciting but In my head, I knew I would to do uh I was going into the newsroom somehow. Also, my dad was uh an editor at the at the Daily Nation. So, you know, it felt like I was really leaning into
uh what was US then.
Okay. Okay. Okay. Uh so then when when uh I left campus I I'd made a friend Kevin Kaburu who was working at roundtrip which was an agency of uh scannard and Coca-Cola was doing a campaign and uh I helped him brainstorm and what we worked on as the brainstorm actually got picked and like okay sir this looks like I can it's something I can do. So that was my introduction into the agency life. I was in agency for for

5:10 maybe what seven eight years
and and maybe you can help us understand when you say you helped him brainstorm
for a campaign
you know what does that process look like what what does that entail
oh it's just the big idea usually you
uh what you do is you you have the big idea the big concept and then the the experiential teams come in and break it down. So when you say big idea, the client has given you a brief
of what they want to achieve.
Yeah.
And then now you come and sit in a room and start to say
what big idea can we can we populate out of this?
Yeah. Basically. Yeah. So but the the usually the client comes with a big idea and say okay so so we are trying to

5:55
we have world cup coming
and uh we are trying to engage the waters. Yes.
So
what how do you think we can best engage the waters? So that's the on the macro that's what the that's the client and then say okay so we are looking at this kind of demographics age you know these are the locations we're looking at
uh in terms of media we are thinking we'll go billboard uh outdoor we'll go digital we'll go experiential
uh we might do TVC's you know we might do branded content and things like that so once you have all that then you ask the big question so How do we reach the people this client is trying to reach in the most creative, most fun way.
Um, yeah. So now you you start breaking down the the the brief and then the big idea and then uh you you break it down to the touch points, you know, like if I go to a kiosk in

6:52
Mushabada,
will I get what these guys are promising that I can get at that level? Yeah.
Okay.
Okay. So you does does that lead you to joining round tree? No, actually I don't join Round Tape. Although I hoped I would. I really hoped I would. Uh cuz I think when you're young and you have your first uh what would ideally look as your like your first idea
uh picked then you know there's some
you know you you've got some something.
Yeah. So you so that was really exciting. Um then um then I was uh then I' I'd started identifying as a creative but on the low level. So cuz I went to All Saints Cathedral every every Sunday I will design the the the church bulletin you know put in the assignments queue in the the hymns. M

7:47
so every Sunday when you come to church and you that bulletin I had my hand in it and it was for a very long time thanks to uh Francis Aando who was then the youth pastor
uh in in the process of doing the the bulleting then I really got good really good at graphic design
uh using coral draw and then I switched to illustrator
uh please note I'm not yet a photographer I have no idea what photography is
so then what happens is Uh Kevin leaves uh leaves the round trip.
Mhm.
And he goes to Pulse Experiential.
Mhm.
When he goes to Pulse Experiential, Yeah. BL comes with Alvaro.
So Alvaro is this new amazing drink, non-alcoholic. Yes.
Uh you know, really viby green and yellow,

8:36
uh pineapple tasting, like it was the thing. M
uh so so Kevin then called me to to pulse and said look we are so we have this thing we're trying to and we're looking for a project manager
for it uh you know and it's a 3 month uh gig
three month gig yeah uh and you know it was a fixed amount we will pay you this amount of money it wasn't a salo
um then Joyce Joyce GU who had been at scannard was then the country director for pulse experience experiential and then Masimia had just come back from the US I think uh maybe a year or so. So she was at first experiential and she has she had experience in in the experiential
um world and she would ideally be my my next final boss in formal employment. Um Patrick Mi Patton was also there was an account director. Uh Rachel was also there. Uh so I met a lot of uh a lot of guys who would again like I said would open crazy doors for me. Wildest doors.

9:49
So you take the gig as a project manager for Alvaro launch.
Yeah. So then as a project manager then you're you sit in oversight for the entire project. Of course you know you have your bosses,
your account directors, your managers but you're literally the point person. So I basically with the help of everyone at uh at uh pass experiential launched Alvaro into the into the market. I worked with Angela Muri who I think now she was a marketing manager at ABL then I think now she's head of digital or innovation at KCB.
Okay.
Yeah. So people would like I said open crazy doors for me.
Yeah.
Okay.
Now where where do you find yourself after that after the 3 months is over?
So after how do you what what have you experienced project managing there? What have you learned and where are you now where that does that push you?

10:47
Yeah. So when when once we do the launch u and the launch the the big idea for the launch was really really crazy
we were going to have uh the launch at the rooftop of KICC.
Mhm.
Uh and the day of the launch it it rained. Uh the good thing with with uh with experiential teams is that people think on their feet. So it looked like it will rain and we're really praying it wouldn't but it looked like it will rain. So what we did is we had contingency just in case it rains we move everyone downstairs to the servo ballroom and uh and launch it from there and I mean it worked. Uh the big idea did I mean it failed rooftop cases you know barriers and but the launch worked um so then I got paid and I was again jobless

11:38
but then Joyce G would call me and tell me you know
can we have coffee maybe you know you we enjoyed working together so I go and meet her and she says look we're together with Mari Mar like look um
and who is Joyce at this time
a country director for
for pulse experiential Yeah.
One of the most amazing human beings on earth.
So they just say, "Look, we we we enjoyed the work we did together. We have an opportunity. Uh if if you're looking to stay on long-term, this will be the terms and that's how I found myself."
And you joined the pulse team.
Yeah. So then I joined the Pulse and then I mean um sometime later Kevin now leave. So I joined PAL again as a as a as a project manager. I I left as a as a creative director.

12:32
Okay.
Now how do you make that transition
within Pulse from an account a project manager to a creative director because you said you joined as a as a project manager but you left as a creative director.
Yeah. So uh so when I when I left uh when I left uh when I left after the 3 months of Alvaro and you know project manager management is literally you know lift the microphone put it there
so then I will be involved in a lot of pitches in a lot of big ideas so we worked a lot with on a lot of stuff we worked on on Pumpas we worked on Taska we worked on Alvaro Guinness Malta I think
uh we we worked on a lot of of brands
so I I moved slowly from um from moving the microphone. Yes. To actually sitting on the mixer, you know, okay, so we have this brief. What do you think we can do?

13:33
Uh so then then I was there for a while. uh but yeah the growth is uh you know you you move and it's it's communicated that okay so now uh you you're moving from project manager to you know maybe account executive you're moving from account executive to concept development you know and things like that um yeah so so uh then pulse had a big uh financial problem which wasn't a which it was um an an internally it was an internal issue
uh in terms of of uh finances. So you would probably have you clients you've worked with not paid or if they've paid the money needs to go elsewhere you know. So you we in a we are in an office that probably needs uh
rentals and things like that. M
uh so we ended up not getting uh paid uh as soon as we would have expected to be paid uh and then fortunes uh started changing for the owners I guess uh or maybe their focus was elsewhere. Oh, sorry. I forgot to say that. Then when I left account executive, then I I became uh I what was I the account manager for alternative media which is which was uh different touch points that will be uh for experiential.

15:08
Okay.
Yeah. So you know like one of the big uh things we did was uh we we we try to brand conveyor belts at the point of sale.
Yes. as part of of marketing
supermarket conveyor belts. So supermarket conveyor belts we try to get into [Music] uh into the airport and things like that as as a as a big so that's that's where I was actually mostly involved you know so what we do this then uh figuring out the media campaign I think we we ran uh on classic 105 for couple of weeks. Yeah, it was it was
So now you you um you said pal starts experiencing uh problems. Yeah. Financial. And I think this is the time that you leave.
This is eventually this is the time that I leave.
Yeah.

16:01
So the thing I I I had and I'm struggling with is I have I have tolerance for for hardship.
You you do.
Yeah. So, I mean, I was working for probably one of the best bosses I've ever lived and and
she wasn't taking the money, but we were not getting paid. So, she also wasn't getting paid, but cuz she's leading the team, you know, she needs to marshall guys up.
Um,
yeah. So, uh, I I held on for a while and then we tried to work flexi hours. uh and flexia was just meant uh so I lived in um and if if I'm coming to to Kilimani
during rash hour
it means I'm paying
maybe 100 B.
Yes. If if I'm really nice, then I wake up early and I'm on the on don the the the train tracks by by 6:45.

17:04
You get that train.
You get that train. Yeah.
Yeah.
But then I I'm like, okay, so why am I coming to work that early? And then from uh from railway to the office was maybe another 30 kit road. But in my head and everyone else was like okay so why are we coming really early and we we all going to you know struggle we don't have sal that then we come to work
when there's work
not when there's work but we come to work uh uh against traffic.
Okay.
Which meant we would come to work late.
Mhm. But the owners of the business will not understand why we are coming at 9:30 10 cuz then it's cheaper for us cuz you're not paying us. But we really, you know, we we we are fighting for for Joyce. That's what we actually we kept saying, you know, like we'll do anything for for Joyce. Yeah. But eventually we just made the hard decision or

18:03
things came to a head and you
Yeah. I think we were paid uh I think we were paid uh bulk uh uh payments for all the monies that had accured and we just said look this thing is not working for us. Uh both of us uh management and and and stuff and guys just started leaving. So, uh some the their account directors left and they started their own uh business and then I I left for maybe a month. Then I I sent a blind mail to um what's the name of this marketing company? Uh they used to be at Vision Plaza. It's good that I've forgotten them. M
yeah cuz it was also a really bad experience. Anyway, so I send a blind email. This guy calls me in and says uh uh we got your email. Would you come for an interview? When I go for the interview, it's actually So they give me a brief and say okay you say you do this here is a brief how would you tackle it? The brief was uh taska project fame.

19:12
Mhm.
And uh and the brief won the job for the agency. So they gave me a brief that was real.
That was real but it was not an interview but it was put it was positioned like it's an interview.
Yeah. Swivel marketing.
Yeah marketing.
Oh Jesus.
So anyway so I was at uh I I stayed at Swivel for about uh 3 months. I worked on uh on uh Cadberries. I worked on Guiney's Guinness Malta. I worked on task project fame and many other different accounts. I think that's the the uh the era where there were those competitions where you would uh I don't should I call them betting I don't even know guys like guys would win uh a car 5 million it was the in thing then for people who I assumed would have

20:08 money
but it was it was also a really bad uh working experience then for me
uh and then uh I was there for about 3 months uh we were not getting paid but we were seeing
you were doing work. Yeah, you're doing work and then you know the thing is when you work with clients, you know, you you you're the one who's doing the invoicing, you're following up. So they tell you, "Oh, by the way, we've sent you your money.
We've paid." Yeah.
Yeah. And then you were not see
but Sal is not coming.
Yeah. I don't even know if that'll be said on this podcast. Maybe you
I mean we we chase authenticity. So is that a a a problem? Because it's it's it you experienced it a lot in your career.

20:52
I did. But so I I this is where it was blatant. So one day I just woke up and and I didn't go to work. So I had been called into the office
uh and uh I was spoken to badly and I was like guys
you're not paying me.
It wasn't and you know and you know I'm a softy I'm a softy like I have like I said your tolerance tolerance is really for suffering is high.
Yeah. So I I I we we spoke uh for a bit. It the speaking didn't go well but then I'd already started getting uh pissed at the entire system.
Yeah.
Uh so before I leave then uh my my really good friend uh uh Susan Mang comes by the office. So Susan Mang and uh Wiko Kahiga and Gideon.
Who is Susan and what does she do?
Susan they used to run uh one of the really first digital agencies in uh

22:01
in in Kenya and then they were working out of IHAB.
Okay. So I' I'd worked with them uh previously um when they were housed in another office where after I left I'd taken some space to try and just figure out what is what is going on you know what direction you want to take. So I had this big idea of you know probably start a print thing. Yeah. So they call me Susan comes and tells me look you're suffering here you come band with us but but but pu sasa we are still in advertising
we are still in advertising when do you when do you transition into how when and how do you transition into photography? So then I go to I go to Sprint Interactive. Yes.
Uh at Sprint Interactive we we we do quite a a bit of work. Uh we were we were not sleeping hungry and we but we we were not making

22:58
still experiential work.
No no now this is digital digital agency work. Yeah.
And now it's just big ideas. So what do we do for this client?
Uh then Marci who was my boss at pulse calls me and tells me hey look I've opened up shop.
Mhm. and I'm looking for somebody with your skill set. Is it a thing you would be willing to? So then I I leave sprint, I go to I go to um it wasn't hu experiential then.
And when you say skill set is your skill set now creative director?
Yes.
You've now become an out and out creative director.
I'm just I'm doing big ideas for expert.
Okay. Uh so then I I was there for a couple of no actually for about 3 years maybe 10 10 years uh this past May uh that's when I leave uh but before I leave I meet uh people who I used to know when I was growing up but now are doing more specific creative things. So Meka had uh had already started photography uh uh uh I think Wangi was Yeah.

24:11
So the the photography was now the new spoken word cuz spoken word had been there you know.
Uh so a lot of guys were a lot of young guys were getting into photography. It was still raw. Then they they they put together a a team called OneTouch Africa. So One Touch Africa will zur the country and the take photos.
So I cuz I knew them. I really wanted to go hang out with them. So there's Jeringig was part of one touch. So I kept saying oh you guys want to come I want to come. So she just told me look you don't have a camera. It makes no sense for you to come. Yeah. If you want to come for by good but you wouldn't learn by watching. You would learn by shooting. Then I got a a small uh gig and I got paid uh 60k. I took the entire 60k went to tow and

25:01 bought uh my first uh camera. So that's how I get into photography.
Through one touch.
Yeah. Through the Yeah. Literally through one touch were these young guys who are first traveling Kenya. Are they the same ones who once took a trip to Kenya, Uganda, Rwanda?
I know them. even as who has been on this podcast as a caterer was with one.
So interesting.
Yeah.
Yeah. So then cuz and purely you know I never I'm not one of those guys who who woke up who grew up saying you know one day I'm going to be you know so I just wanted to hang out with this guys and then out with cameras
and it looks like it's a it's a good thing. So I went got a Rebel T2i with two kit lenses for I think 55K.

25:54
Okay. That's Nikon.
No. No. Canon.
Canon. Canon. Rebel 2T. Yeah.
Never ever mentioned Nikon.
Nikon.
The Canon. Nikon guys.
Yeah. Okay. So then uh then we at u at at Massie's farm you experiential. Uh I we had uh we had uh what's the name of this soap guy? I I feel so bad that I've forgotten.
Mhm.
Uh Ariel. So Ariel Ariel Ariel had uh had come in as a client and we needed to do print collateral for them. Mhm.
So Mi just said, "Look, you No, we so we got a guy who who said he's a designer and then he sent us really horrendous work."
Uh I know him and he's a brother to my friend, so I won't mention it here, but he did some terrible work for us. So M was like, "Look, I see you with a camera. You've taken a few photos. You think you can hack this?"

26:59
And that's how I got literally into photography. So I I shot and she paid me. Said,
"And you shot what? What do you
I like I shot the packaging
the packaging of the show. But now how do you
It was but it was a really bad photo. It's just that it was going into print.
Yes.
And uh and uh in terms of graphic design,
what whatever we needed to do was not that extensive.
But what how do you know what to shoot?
Lighting you still know.
Then lighting was was was Yeah. Like my lighting for that park was really really bad.
Yeah. So then I leave um then I leave uh I leave Massie's farm and I I and I leave not knowing I was going to go into photography. I leave to go start uh uh a creative support agency for experience small experiential companies and like okay I'll be your first client and for one year she was my first client. I did some work with USAD. I did some work with u with uh with I think the Danish embassy. I'm not sure.

28:05
And now have you become now a full bonafide member of One Touch?
No. No. I'm I I was never ever member of One Touch.
Yeah. So you just bought your camera and you started shooting. They were your friends.
Yeah. So like I would go I I think I went for a couple of trips with them. I think we went to Champ the board of Kenya and and TZ I think and uh and one more but then there will be this instit there'll be these competitions with you know so you'll always be there you'll always be with the same guy but I was never ever a member of one touch so now you've become you first you become first you I think your first foray into h your own space where you're not working for someone is this uh creative

28:52
support for crypt support agency formemes.
Yeah.
Yes.
What what uh what I didn't know and I didn't learn also when it happened is uh because I had I had a uh a client as a boss um as my former boss and he guaranteed me work. So it eased the cost of paying me, but then I would be paid per project, which was easier. So when there are no projects,
you don't have work. Yeah.
Yeah. Uh and then the USID gig, but then those those avenues quickly dried up. Uh because I I don't think that would have been sustainable as a creative support agency. Also, there was a lot of uh with with other organizations, there was a lot of intended handhand dealings. uh which is a thing that I I have vowed that uh

29:45
you're not participating
you know I'm not I'm not buying gigs and I'm not paying for gigs.
Yeah. Um uh which is which is uh you know I I credit uh my my lack of a of a Land Rover convoy Land Rover that would have been my Land Rover but
cuz I said you know and and and it's it's in my head uh you know and dealings were covert. This this one not covert. you know guys will tell you look we have this gig we need 5 m I'm like I don't have 5 m like even if I wanted the gift I had 5 m you know so yeah so uh that port quickly dried up if I can if we can leave the career side a bit and come to the family side how is how is this been taken on your on your family front you know parents who anticipated that you'd become a doctor and then you changed to coms but Now you have had this space. How how is that side of things been taken?

30:55
Yeah. So my you know my my my dad died uh earlier on.
Yeah. So it was it was easier I think. Uh I don't know if it would have been easier. Uh but my mom was my mom was more willing to allow me
to allow you to find yourself.
Yeah. And I wasn't getting into any trouble like you know my mom uh has never been called
uh by the cops or by somebody saying oh you know this guy did this you know I've never had those cases as a teenager I had had quite a bit of uh
rough ages teenage drama
that some beating smoothen but then you know my mom has never had to deal
with drama or any of any of my siblings okay
with uh with heart stopping drama.
So that allowed you to then build your

31:47
and then I was making I was making money uh and you know with a small small money I will support my my siblings where needed and I will support my mom as well. So
we are not stealing.
It was working.
It was working and it's it's work that you can trace like you can go and say okay mom did this.
This is what I do.
Yeah.
Okay.
So it was easier. So now we we understand now how you got into photography. It was it wasn't a well-laid plan.
It wasn't.
But you find yourself there and you have now through trial, error, lot a lot of work that you probably look at now and cringe but
but you now find yourself. So how's the life of a photographer in Kenya?
All right. So, so from then to now,

32:34
I think I think it's uh it's gradual like there's there's a lot of uh there's a lot of things going on. So, for my case, I I did what every photographer did. I shot weddings, I shot ratios, I shot baby bumps, I shot um
uh birthdays, I shot events. Uh and uh most of this work was was given
you know somebody saw me with a camera or you know
or referred you.
Yeah. And then I would I would uh I would shoot a lot at All Saints and Maveno then. Um uh so then my my my growth was gradual but there was still no plan. Mhm.
Um then I I took up a a creative director gig at Maveno for about uh what slightly about a year uh which also really just helped me uh figure out my creativity, you know. And I I keep saying uh that if you if you want to be really really creative, the church is the space you really want to be at. Yeah.

33:49
But I also say that the church will hurt you deeply.
Yeah. And I think I live both I think really let me down. Uh so anyway, so the the last day I'm leaving uh I'm leaving uh my work officially as a creative director at large at Mavun. I'm in the car with uh with uh I'm with one of the I forget her name. I'm doing badly with names.
And she's with her daughter Theo and uh I'm seated at the back. They're giving me a lift to to back to to river and I just say, you know, I saw a billboard and I just you know, one day I'm going to be the best advertising photographer in Kenya and then I'll go on and conquer the world. And then she said, "Oh, even uh our friend P says that Pman the biker." I was like, "Okay, shalom." It was shalom. Sorry. So I shalom said,

34:55 "Oh, even our friend Pman says that P is also a really good photographer." So I said, "Okay, cool." And then that's it. Uh in the process, I have my work. I'm posting a lot of work. It's being seen. There's a bit of traction here.
Posting where? Instagram.
On no on uh on Instagram, but mostly on Facebook cuz I am that age. Yeah. M.
So, I I do the I do the posts and then I get uh I get a DM from somebody I know from the socials who will eventually come and be one of my good friends. uh and they say look uh we have a client uh they're opening five hotels uh four hotels and one resort and the hotels are going to be in uh Acra
Lagos uh Nairobi and Adis and the resort is going to be somewhere in the wild in Kenya

35:53
that we are looking for somebody to do to shoot the food
and uh you know the menu and it was purely food and I'm like, "Okay, cool." So, I I send my quote like, "Oh, great. You you you you have the job." And I am really excited. So, I go I go to I go to Land Rover Kenya and look at the price of a defender. I'm like, "You're ready. You've arrived."
I'm like, "So, you go. Now, where do you shoot this work?" I don't shoot this work.
So So we we agree, you know, I send him my my my details, you know, I'm going to get paid. It looks like I'm going I'm going to make a lot of money cuz you know, they're paying for your flights, they're paying for the work, they're giving you PDMs. Um then I really don't understand. Please not have been in the agency, but I don't understand how agency works with with uh with uh photographers. So a week to when the intended shoot is

37:04 about to happen like oh sorry we forgot to ask you my creative director as for a portfolio
a what? Apple
you don't have
so I I I go she just send what you have. So I go pick my my photos that have a moim over here. eats food and I've shot at weddings and he just calls me and tells me and I would have really loved to work with you but client is not going to flight this portfolio.
Oh wow.
So my world crashes. So then I I I I cuz I I I wasn't drinking. I went and bought a 2 liter Fanta and just cried my sorrows. Then uh then I called uh I called my friend or I didn't call her we just met uh Nepuro Nepuro Kwa also from agency and I just explained to her and then she told me you know uh the No, she did she didn't she didn't tell me then. So I I uh one of uh my growing up friend was a at the Santorium at

38:16 Sankara Hotel. So I tell her, "Oh, by the way, you know, I'm trying to get a food portfolio. Is it possible?" Cuz no, in my head it's like, you know, how can I get a food portfolio as fast as possible to try and salvage this gig in case they haven't found anyone?
So I call her. I never got the gig. It it went, but uh I got I got business from the same people, big business. So I I I call Anita Anita Gonga. I tell her I'm trying to do this like ah you wait. So she calls me later and says oh I've spoken to a marketing guy said you can come you talk. So I call Nepuro uh and tell her you know there's there's probably some conversation we can have at Sankara let's go. So when you go to Sankara this person that we meet KJA went to school with Nepo. So you when guys say so you you know the and they say you know your your problem is three people separated from you now they used to say it was 6° now it's like three people

39:20
uh and if you're really really bold it's just a single WhatsApp
yeah so we go in we we talk with Ka then she says uh let me talk to my boys uh Joyce Angeline uh so they call me and say okay you can come and shoot on condition that we co own the photos you post them for your portfolio as guys will use them for you and then they said we'll let you know when you can shoot so I wait then they called me when they were having a branch was it a branch they having
Sankara now
so call you yeah
and Sankara laid out food worth 75,000 shillings for me to shoot
Mhm. So I shot the tomahawk, shot spare ribs, I shot in uh I shot at Greece, I went upstairs to the rooftop bar.
Okay.
Like they like this went all out.

40:12
Said you you shoot let's uh share the images and that's how I made my first food portfolio. That portfolio gave me I mean it serves me up to today.
Wow.
Yeah. So the they would then call me later and pay me, you know, like I say, I really have a soft spot for Sankara and Serena Hotels cuz when I needed to do what I needed to do, their doors were wide open like never ever held back uh and now the Norfolk uh Yeah. So you you then be out of this let's call it what it is benevolence of of of Sankara you now build your food portfolio
and I build them
and this food portfolio becomes the the foundation
of of what I
of how you sell yourself as as as a photographer.
Yeah. So I I shot went and edited I shared all the photos with them. I took the ones that I really wanted, put up a portfolio and I would walk in to I would go from B to B. Hi, can I speak to the manager? I'm a photographer. I'm looking for

41:22
really
and say, oh, and then I'll say here's my portfolio. And then I will just send it on WhatsApp. Like it was literally on WhatsApp. Oh, what's your number?
We finished the conversation before I am downstairs. You already have my portfolio. And uh and that's how my my food photography grew. While shooting food, I realized that food comes with drinks. And uh and then I started shooting drinks. So I shot for five senses.
I shot for Serena.
Let's get into the technicality of this food photography because I'm sure audience is listening
and they are wondering,
food is food, you know. So I take a photo of food. Yeah.
What do you mean by professional food photography?
Yeah, that that's you know when when we shoot uh when we shoot uh food and uh you go to a client.

42:20
So I'm saying what what you see as food on on on advertise they even have a disclaimer say the food may appear different
from what is advertised cuz it's really propped up. So now that the propping up the the the the making the food look good
is uh is is the work that then I I got into doing and you know that that's a lot of timing on when the food is short how how fast is it coming out from the kitchen are we supporting it you know are we are we building you know when when they say let's build a burger it's literally built you know at the back you know we have toothpicks that are holding you have glue you um
for it to sit in a certain way for it to appear.
Yeah.
Yeah. In that appealing nature

43:10
for the client to then or for the consumer to then want, oh man, I really want that.
Yeah. And and you know, for me, my my my mantra is I shoot food that you can taste. Like photos. I I'll give you photos that you can taste.
Okay. Yeah. So you know how uh shot I think we shot a burger for KFC uh we shot uh uh some food for again Sankara.
So what what how does this so you now get into this space? Yeah.
But in the early days when you're you're you're sharing walking from bar to bar restaurant to restaurant and sharing your portfolio on WhatsApp does that give you work? It does. But but this experience where I could have gone to across Africa to shoot food only opened my eyes to oh my god there's a big Mhm.

44:03
commercial photo world for food there. I just want to get that point clearly. So the failed experience, the job that you didn't get is the one which opened your eyes to what the potential of photography is.
Yeah. And it's just, you know,
what do you do with that knowledge?
So then I push myself hard to try and get into into the faces of the people who make decisions on when and how
food is shot.
Who are these people? These are these are uh hotel owners and uh and managers
and then uh and then brand managers.
Yes.
For for food brand
food products. Food brands. Yeah.
Yeah.
Uh and then agencies, the people who do the production.
Okay.
Uh so I'm I'm shooting both drinks. So the the food is the most

45:00
professional bit, but the the the drinks are not yet professional. M
uh cuz you know I've not figured out how I can put a glass of beer and choma next to each other yet.
But when I look at photos I'm like these things always go together.
Uh and then uh COVID hit. before co had written on on on on uh on Twitter that I'm going to be the biggest uh I'm going to be uh I was manifesting and you know manifesting works I was manifesting that I was going to be uh the chief product photographer for for DIO brands
Mhm. locally and abroad. And I took a Twitter in a good job. Uh and from that tweet, uh and you know, I'd already started sharing my my photography work now on Twitter and heavily on IG. From that tweet, somebody from Ogilv just called me and said, "Hey, we might have a thing here. Do you think you can do it?" So I said, "Yeah, I can do it." Um, and I that was my first uh commercial uh product gig. So I shot White Cup.

46:16 Uh I shot at 209 state house. Uh there was a studio there uh photo magic. Uh and uh and that's when I got into the
Let me let me stop you there and ask you to just expound. When you say you shot white cup, what does shooting white cup mean? Because it's a bottle, it's a drink. So, what are you doing? Things just for the lane man who's not a professional photographer. Are you What are you doing? You're opening it. You're pouring it.
No. No. So, yeah. So, we we we do the the the the pour shots. Uh we didn't do the opening cuz uh I mean, how do you
in my head, you know, how do you know? So we just did product show that will go into uh into into digital spaces. So you get the bottle, you prop it up, you clean it, you do the spray the spritz.

47:12
So those guys of when we see that bottle with the droplets of water that show it's cold. Those are your things. That's your word.
We've been cooking
as they say.
Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. So, I shoot I shoot um White Cup and then COVID hits. Uh when COVID hits, uh there's technically no work, but then brands move online. Um, so when uh when they moved online, so when I shot White Cup, then it made sense for me how I can shoot food and alcohol at the same time.
And White Cup was was so gracious like we'll send you the product, you send you just send us the photos. Uh, brilliant, brilliant agency. Paid me on time. Um uh you know then I would uh I would shoot for for fast food chains, Java, um Big Square, I shot for and you know it was it was those combos. Then [Music] sorry. So then the my mind then connected food and drinks they go together. Uh and then because it was COVID, I set out uh and you know I was

48:44 really paranoid during COVID. I was like the whole world is going to die. I'm never leaving the house. My relatives you can't visit if you come away from there. So I I was when people are locked down me I was properly locked down and I didn't have a creative outlet and this is what I say to every creative every visual artist that every creative must own the primary tools of trade. The thing that worked for me is that I had bought my own lights and I had my own camera and lenses. So at uh night when people would go to sleep cuz I was literally bored, I would uh I would uh set up and it was it was a really uh small setup. I'd set up at uh at maybe 9 10 and I'll shoot all the way to about 3 4.
What are you shooting?

49:40
Just products. I'm just practicing.
Okay.
Yeah. Just I'm practicing and then you know I I I shoot and I post. I shoot and I post.
That's what's keeping you sane. during this co period.
Yeah. So then I we got we got uh we we got a gig for I think it was peak and peel or one of these brands that needed uh product photography and I went to shoot at a studio. When I went to shoot at the studio uh then I was able to know also you know how does a professional uh product photography set looks like? like you know cuz when I was shooting uh a white cup I was shooting as me uh I was sent for the product I I shot they were approved but then when I went onto that set then I I I just talked to the studio and told him look uh I I want to do a lot more of this and I want to do a bit more practice heavy practice is it okay if if uh I can use your space when you don't have business and then when I have business I'll I'll bring and shoot. Yeah.

50:47
And it worked for a while. So, so what I did, I went I went uh from downstairs from Lovington Mall. I went into Charana. I bought a six-pack of uh of uh Hinekin bottles, a six-pack of the I think it's 500 ml and a six-pack or 300 ml and I just put them in front of my camera and I think I shot the whole day. Uh that work as a personal project costed me not more than 6K. That one project I can't tell you how much it has brought. I can't
cuz you you posted
Yeah. I can't count. So when when I posted then the TUSA guys were like are you you shot this? Yeah. Are you sure? Like yeah. So the the one of the agency guy said, "You can can you send me the raw photos of this?" I'm like, "Why would I send you? We just want to make sure that you're the one who shot." I I shared and the next thing I knew, I was shooting Tusca uh maybe a couple of weeks later, which which is the thing that uh you

52:01 know, I keep saying that um and Chris Adoir, I picked this from Chris Adoir. Chris Adwa says every practicing creative grows and the key word is practicing. If you practice you grow. So when the task brief came I was ready because you had you know uh uh my partner would go to the supermarket and come with products and before they're sh I'll just take them and you know just arrange them on like a small set at home and just shoot shoot edit shoot edit. uh my editing was uh not as good but then I you know I was able to partner with uh really good retouchers. Uh so I shot Taska which I don't know I don't know when when I shot Tusca I was probably the first uh I was probably among the first uh Kenyan photographers to shoot Tusca. Now Tusca is purely shot by Kenyans cuz that's how much we've we've grown. Yeah, but but that's what I mean that's what they said.

53:10
But first of all, we are running out of time. But we I think your your your there are some things that you have said and I'm going to try and summarize them into what I've heard. Yeah.
First of all, your your rude is
is it correct to say unplanned?
Yeah. In the sense that it kind of evolved. you you evolved into it. Yeah.
But you've also been a huge huge beneficiary of I think what keeps you doing what you do is that you're perpetually learning
and you're perpetually trying you know when you when you have downtime you have your camera. So my question to you is having walked this journey and now being someone who earns your bread and butter from photography and the creative industry you have been in it for a long time. Yeah.

54:08
What advice do you have to the young people who are coming into this space and as the space continues to evolve? What are you seeing going into the future?
There's this new world of AI that is coming to affect your work. you guys quite significantly. So what what would you say you see and and and where are we going?
Yeah. Like so the heel I die on is like you have you have to practice and you have to show your work. Yeah. Uh and uh and collaborate. Uh you know again they say that practice makes perfect. Imagine what perfect practice can do for you.
Mhm.
Yeah. um my road was unplanned and even now as we speak I am I am really in my head I know that uh because it's my finger and my camera uh I don't know uh what sustainability looks like uh for me uh in terms of in terms of photography I would I am I'm actively pursuing other u avenues for creative uh enterprises.

55:20
Yes.
Uh, you know, I'm I'm strongly working on uh putting up u maybe a a theater company as we speak and I still want to do heavy writing and heavy film. But yes, my I'm I I I and you know I I have no shame to say that I stumbled in into this photography space and I've excelled and the I think the reason I have been able to excel is uh the the creative endeavors that I've put my mind to I for some reason I'm I'm able to excel. Uh if I I don't know if it would work if I was doing academic stuff.
Yeah. Oh, this has been a fabulous uh thing for me because h I'm a closet photographer myself.
But just hearing what you've done and you you are in my space because food photography is my world. I know we have worked together at Big Square. We've worked together at on in the cakes business that we run.

56:23
And so mine is just to thank you for coming and sharing your story and uh in great detail. And I I think what I take away from what you have done is that um there's no path that's straight you know and maybe I can give you a chance to speak to the audience to say where you can be found your handles you know so that uh uh those that would like to to have a look having watched the podcast and would now like to have a look at your work local African continental regional international Where can they find you on what portals and and so on?
Oh yeah. So you uh I I'll just say one thing before I close that you know this this world looked closed to me until I got into it. I think the the one thing we've been able to effectively do is we've been able to get keep some of these spaces.

57:18
Yes. And uh you know and cuz you said you're a closet photographer. I think these spaces are for everyone to agree. Yeah. like you don't have you don't need permission
to to% we are over 300 billion a year industry
and the guy who's taking the most is probably taking
1 billion if they're taking it you know but you you can find me every on social media at Pinski
okay
yeah so ladies and gentlemen uh Paulo aka Poshinski brilliant product photographer. Uh, and you can find find him at Pchinski, that's P AU S H I N S K I um on Twitter, on Instagram, on Facebook, and look, have a look at his work, see what he's doing. And thank you very much for joining us on episode 38 of the African Do podcast where we um feature excellent Africans executing excellently. Excellent. And um I think there's

58:28 something you said that I want you to repeat maybe as we close out.
You said about what's that thing you said about practice perfectly.
No. Uh they we say and we've seen
that practice makes perfect.
Yes. Imagine
imagine what perfect practice can do for you. I think those years for me were for perfecting the practice.
We leave you imagining what perfect practice can do for you. Thank you very much ladies and gentlemen and see you at the next