Tosh Gitonga — transcript

Primary Picture

This transcript is generated automatically by YouTube and has not been checked by a person. It misspells names and mishears words, particularly around Kenyan English and company names, so read it as a guide to the conversation rather than a quotable record. Each timestamp opens the video at that moment.

0:01 [Music] Uh, greetings ladies and gentlemen. Welcome to episode 27 of the African Do podcast. Today we delve into the world of film production, movies and with me is a good friend Tosh Gonga of Primary Picture. Tosh, welcome to the
Thank you very much. First podcast by the way.
Yeah. First podcast. We are privileged guy. We are privileged.
Yes. So Tosh um you bust onto the scene. I think that's the way that's the way I experienced it. You bust onto the scene with Nairobi Halflife. You know we didn't know you or rather I didn't know you and then pop this Nairobi Halflife comes. It's all the rage, all the talk. But before we get into the details of that, there must have been a long journey behind that to get to the part where you're producing a a movie of that

0:56 caliber.
Mhm. So, how do you find yourself in film? Um, isn't it the way everybody finds that's how you come onto the scene, you know? It's always like
people feel like it's overnight success because that's now we know you after one thing, you know.
Um, wow. It's interesting how I got into film. What I knew from high school from a long time ago was that I was not a 9 to5.
Okay. And uh when I was thinking about what I want to pursue in my career, um I was like I cannot sit behind a desk. So all these accounting jobs um office kind of blue collar jobs were out of the question. And um the one thing that stood out uh because of a neighbor that I had was marketing. I had a neighbor who worked for EABL and he's always on the move.

1:48
Yeah.
I was like okay. And then one day I asked him what he does. Said he does marketing. And he explained to me that he has to visit markets. And and then I met another friend of mine um a girl I was dating back then. Her sister worked for for BAT. So same kind of job.
And I was like okay this is this is what I want to study for.
And so I did marketing in college. And then after college, you know, you need internship. And my auntie Jerago had just come back from um the states where she was working in Hollywood um BET Hallmark and she she was back home. So my mom was like um Gwen, you know, hung around her so he can understand the professional world. Mhm.
And so I started hanging out with my auntie and she's like, "What's the film industry like here?" And at the time I did not know anything about film, local film or you know uh anything like that. Um I was young. I think I was 19 years old and um I I said that was my hanging out with her. That internship was the best thing that ever happened to me because

3:09
till today I apply what I learned from her.
And what I learned from her was starting something from nothing,
you know, cuz we once they're sitting there in her office
and she's like, "Let's make a movie."
Mhm.
And I was like, "What movie?" She said, "I don't know. We'll figure it out."
That was a conversation. And then we made a movie called Dangerous Leazens. I don't know if you
Yes. I remember it
dangerous affairs.
Um and they ca the name came from dangerous leazison from an old movie that she was watching the night before. We call it leazison for a long time until we change it to dangerous affair and and and seeing that process you know from idea you know from the initial spark of an idea to an actual product that went out and sold uh for me became the ultimate lesson and

4:08
sold where? Uh we we saw we were selling um after we made the movie um
um she was like okay you you did marketing right? I say yeah so like go and sell this movie.
So I remember we had this Toyota Corolla and then we
um uh she had an old friend who who used to be based in town.
Um so showed us how to dub the the VHS tapes.
Okay.
VHS. It's not you're not even on this no CD. You're in VHS. Uhhuh.
Uhhuh.
Um in town, River Road. So I learned how to go to River Road.
Yes.
Find those machines that used to dab the tapes. Um where I met a good friend of mine, Col, still friends still today.
Yes.
And um we would um I I would move around with boxes in the car and and taped posters on the side of a door and go to supermarkets. remember Chumi those days, you know, I said, "Please

5:08
just put the movie here. It's a good movie. I think we're selling it for 500 Bob."
Um, and we just kept pushing that way. There was no YouTube at the time wasn't a thing.
Mhm.
So, it was really being present in spaces that people were going into by.
Yeah. And and when I think about it, it was difficult, but I was young, energetic, it was fun. again it was not to yeah
okay so now you you go and you have this let's call it what it is then because that's a life-changing internship you know an internship that helps you discover yourself so to speak
so um what happens after that so I'm I was like okay I like this you know we we were working late you know it was fun it was cool we're cracking jokes it wasn't like work you know for me I was like if this is how this thing is like

6:07
then um I really am enjoying it
but when I think back I've always been about entertainment I went to boarding school ve uh by the time I was in uh in primary school I was in charge of the common room and the TV
yes
uh when I went to high school I was drama chairman you know so the the patterns were there but I just hadn't
realized or discovered.
And so after that, I was like, I really like this, you know, and um and we would work up to late in the office. We're hanging out. Uh would and and also the discipline part I learned from it, you know. We would hang out till 2 3:00 a.m. at 6:00 a.m. We're back at it, you know. And I remember the first time I was woken up at 6:00 and I'm like you went to bed at 3:00 and my hand's like, "Yeah, that's that's your problem. You

7:05 know, the day starts at 6:00. Um, if you cannot wake up at 6:00, then you should go to bed earlier." And again, a lesson of
you decide, you know. Um,
this is the gig.
This is the gig. You decide, you know. Um, you can also go to bed early. You can forgo, you know, the hanging or the chilling out. It's up to you as long as you you can wake up. Um as that's the time um um I I think there was a movie coming to Kenya, The White Messiah. I don't know if you remember that movie with Jenny Pont.
Mhm.
And so um I I I I applied and got a job as a as a PA.
Mhm. uh with the carpenters, you know, the guys who go before Yes.
to build a set.
Yes.
So, I got the job as a PA beforehand there in a place called WA past

8:02
past isol past um Samburu
on your way to Master on that.
Yeah. Way before the Oh my god. It used to take a day from Isol to get to get just to Shaba. No, just to get Shab Shab.
It used to take at least
more than half a day. And so WA was way past so really far but then adventure you know um so did that worked there
you're doing what you're going to
step yeah you know just the production leazison you know making sure the carpenters are getting what they need
in informing production of the progress of the set building uh and so forth so that's the first time I ever came face to face with a puffer you I had a tent. You know those Coleman tents?
Yes.
I like till today I cannot sleep in a tent on the ground.

8:57
No way. I'd rather stay up the whole night
cuz I was sleeping and I could feel this thing
moving. You can feel something.
No, just a like a soft lump, you know, um the whole night. But I didn't know what it was. I thought it was like a log. And so the following morning I was like with a camp attendance like let's move my tent cuz there's something under that. Yo puff
it was insane. Yeah. So that was a kind of you know life that we were living then.
Okay.
And I was really enjoying it. So it it became a from job to job from there.
Okay.
Um I'm at Blue Sky. Um uh if you know Blue Sky biggest production company we all learned from them.
Blue Sky Films.
Yeah. Mario and Jimal Hal Sha. Um

9:49
very good producer. So we
so I started now I I came out of my auntie's sort of shell
under her wing. You you you are now finding yourself.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But I still were making the local films. There was another one after called Baboo's Babies.
Yes.
Um there was another one called Project Daddy. uh we did with Wangeshi. I don't know if you remember that one. Yeah. So now I was fully in.
You have found yourself now. You're in that group. Kabisa. It's not an internship.
You have now found what you want.
Yeah. As a and a PA, but really all over. I really loved it. So I was really working hard.
Okay.
First one in, last one out kind of thing.
Yes.
Um Yeah. And then I start find myself more in the director's department. So I really came up from you know from PA third they call them the third assistant director, second assistant director, the first assistant director and then finally to director.

10:47
Okay.
Okay. Wow. Okay. It's a it's a long story.
So that's that's a that's a that's quite a a a transition.
When do you then make up your mind to go solo and say okay this or set up an outfit?
Oh okay. Um, so I work my way up. I'm now first assistant director. I'm also working with different companies, sounds and picture.
Um, doing adverts as a first assistant director. Uh, me and my friend Easy. I don't know if you know easy on
in the industry, strategists. Um, and um, so we were like the top first assistant directors back then. So it was either me or him. Okay.
And we we were working both commercials uh working movies at the time and then Mnet came and said they want to do um a high-end TV series and they set out um a call and two briefs were very good. There was one called the agency um it was done by the year brothers.

12:00
Yes. And then another one called um God, what was it? Changes.
Yes.
Which I which I worked on.
Yes.
And so because they wanted one, they decided, okay, both are good.
Mhm.
So we'll do the first season of each. The one that people like gets to go on.
Yeah.
Um luckily for us and unfortunately for the industry, I don't know what happened with the other one. they didn't get to finish the pro agency didn't finish
agency didn't finish they had problems
and so then changes naturally
became it
went through so I I was first assistant director on the first one and Jo was a producer with another lady called Margra Kibbe and um I had extensive um experience being on set

12:51
yes
um the director um was a documentary director very good uh and we working together. So as we working you know like because of time and being an assistant director I kept suggesting things you know to make things move faster
or move you know so we can make our days cuz that was my job.
Yes.
And little did I know that the producers were like maybe he has an eye of a director. So till today I credit Joey and Margaret to to my directing career.
Okay.
Yeah. I I still you know we we we came from a time when directors were like small gods in those big productions that we worked on
as PA or you know those second assistant directors. You don't get to be in the video village. You don't see what's being shot. You know, the director always came in his own car, came last when you guys have been there since 4:00 a.m., you know, just came and when he came, things moved, you know, like, so for me, directing was like those are small gods. So I'm I'm no, you know, and so for me, I never thought I could be.

14:08
Mhm.
Um, so come season two, Joey calls me and she's like, "We like you to direct two." I said, "Excuse me?" I like yeah say hell no way I'm not a director and imagine she was patient to me for like two weeks
as was vehemently like no way
but then in the two weeks you know once an idea is put in your head then you start to think about it then you ask people and like actually maybe you could you know and so I after two weeks like this I agreed very scared Yeah.
Yeah. Because it's the unknown for you.
Yeah. It's an unknown and now the back ends with me, you know, before at the end of the day I could always be it's not my core, you know. Um
and so that was my first time directing changes season 2 13 episodes um um that we shot out of sequence very difficult. Uh till today I say um it does not make sense for one director to to direct a whole series. It's too much work.

15:18
Yeah.
Um you end up becoming an automatic factory setting at one point.
Uh so it was very very difficult. Um we're trying to schedule we're we're working out of sequence so we're not being able to complete episodes in time. At that time we hadn't learned how to do in blocks and so forth
and but we solded on you know are you at any time now in this time are you cognizant of what you're doing in a local context because we we didn't really you know you guys were in it guys were seeing it from the outside right
so we are like man local content is now becoming you know when you look at um sometimes I go on to YouTube you know and I look those things I used to watch as a kid you know and I look at those sets and I'm like hey we've come from far because but were you when you're in it are you cognizant of what is happening industrywide around you the change that is now

16:21
not really
cuz we were that was like the first prop the pioneers yeah
yeah I mean um Benja my friend Benja had come up with um some shows on NTV. Uh there was Mali with Alison, you know, quality for for for me at the time. I never I I was so I was focused on doing it,
doing a good job. Yeah.
Like quality for me was paramount. I was not thinking about am I going to be better than this other person or am I that never occurred to me. It was about
I cannot let anyone down. you know, I felt I'd been given a huge responsibility and for me that was the, you know, that was the uh the biggest thing, but also I discovered myself then that I really enjoyed it. You are loving it.
Oh, I I directing performance for me was I I came alive that time 2009, never forget.

17:27
Yes. Um, and so I knew there was no going back now. Okay. And so I got into it and it was as much as difficult it was to, you know, um, direct, um, I would spring out of bed every morning, you know, I never time. Yeah. Yeah.
Okay.
And then Nairobi Halfife came shortly after that.
How does Nairobi Halfife come? Um Tony Remo, locations manager, um worked with him in all these other projects that I was talking about
called me and says um I'm setting up an outdoor cinema in Kira for a film,
a short film that we did
um with Ginger Inc. I used to have Ginger.
I hadn't met her yet. um would like come and help me set it up in Kira. I say cool. So I go over and we're setting up um outdoor cinema, kids come and then the film plays and I remember being transfixed in by the film.

18:40
Yeah. Like it was Soul Boy by Hower.
Yeah. I'm like this. It's like seeing yourselves on the silver screen, you know, like big screen and you're seeing Kira and you're seeing a well done film, the story that's flowing.
And I was so mesmerized. I was like, I want to do that now. I want to do something like that. And then Tony says, yeah, there's a program that starting called One Fine Day Films um run by Tom Tika with Ginger. You should apply. Mhm.
I said, "Of course." Where? Um M introduced me to Ginger that time. Um and then um the the application was a one minute video. Uh you do a one minute video about yourself.
Yeah.
Uh instead I went and shot a scene. I wrote a scene. At the time remember I was shooting changes. Yes. So on set

19:37
I had um Nick Muma.
Yes. and uh Kevin Boga, Jan Boga's brother, very amazing actor.
Yes.
Um and I pulled them aside at at when we had a break.
I said, "I wrote this scene in the morning and I woke up at 4
and it's for an application. Is guys help me out just film it
and then I got my DP Maria Sen. We went quickly and we just shot the scene." Um and that's how I applied. Tom later came and told me and he saw that scene he knew I was going to be the one to be
one minute.
Yeah. Just one minute. Um and that's how I got in. I think were over 800 directors, aspiring directors that applied and they only taking eight.
Mhm.
Um and so we were there eight directors for a two week master class and one of us was going to be directing the first film.

20:34
Okay.
Which we didn't even know what it was. Mhm.
Um until at the end when we finished cuz you do a the two week um and that's why I believe in them. Like I just came from running a course with CC Hub for directors.
Yes.
That's how I got into this. You know it's it's we may think these things don't work but
but they work.
Yeah. Where you make a short film out of it and you learn in such a short time but you get so much.
Yeah.
Um
and yeah. So then um at the end of it, Tom calls me and says, "You're going to be our director.
You're it, man."
Yeah. And I don't know why they ask you at the end whether they're still waiting for you to say yes or no.
But I'm like, "What do you mean?" Of course. And I remember saying, "Yeah, but I still have to ask you." I say, "Oh, no, no, no. It's definite."

21:28
Um, and then I got the script halfife. Actually, he sent me the script and said, "Please have a read. take your time uh um and take your two days or something, read it, and then call me back and say if you want to do it. I read up to 10 pages, page 10.
Yeah.
I'll never forget I called him back. I said, "I'm doing this.
It's insane."
10 pages. 10 pages.
I didn't finish the script.
And I said, "Yeah, I'm doing this." And so I got into it. So only directed TV, not a movie, never shot. All I had was my instinct and my experience as a first assistant.
Yeah.
And there you go.
And that was
man, that thing when that thing hit the scene, I remember watching that thing and I was like,

22:18
hey, I don't know if you understand the vibe it gave me. You know, you you you've grown up seeing things. Yeah. And then you see I I I keep on telling guys that even this podcast one of the reasons I'm doing it is I think we underestimate the power of seeing yourself.
Yeah.
You know when when you see yourself you see your life you see the things
up town mid you see you see your existence in a well produced movie or series you know it changes so much.
No that's true.
Yeah. And so when I watched this thing I was like I remember I was like we have we have arrived now now we have arrived when guys say you know even um I studied out of the country so I'm thinking about what can I share with my friends you know to get them a feel of Nairobi life you know and give them

23:11
with all its nuances good and bad you know I say hey watch this movie you'll enjoy it
you'll enjoy it. It gives me by the way Nairobi Halfife gives me a lot of vibes of what's this thing from sto with based in Baltimore
Idris the one which broke the wire the wire the wire a show I really like but it gives me vibes like that because that was you know you feel like you know Baltimore you've never been to Baltimore but you're like I know this place and that's what
inspirations the wire and um city of god Okay.
My huge inspiration.
Okay. Yeah. Yeah. When I watch Nairobi and I watched it several times after that. So it's it's really good. So after this is a high you know you you go through first of all getting into this thing

24:01
is work you know 800 guys whittleled down to eight intense two weeks and then you're the one and then you shoot and then it airs. It's it was the buzz in Nairobi. So now, how do you So from there,
so yeah, so this is the first time you're being thrown into this, you know, you're doing something you love.
Mhm.
You know, and
you you you don't know the attention. You've never experienced the attention. And for me, it was just about making an awesome film. And I was, you know, I had Tom as a mentor.
I was learning from him as the same time we were fighting. Yes.
Because you know um he's supposed to be a teacher and him there were places where he felt I should have done things differently and like no this is the way I feel it should be done.

24:55
Um I remember one time
asking him is it me directing or is it you?
And then it hit me oh my god did I just ask an international famous director?
Yeah. Um but he loved that he loved the passion I had you know
and once I was that passionate about there's some things I was like I could see why he's come the ones I refused you're like okay fine you know it was really very interesting relationship we had um but then come um premier
so we're looking for festivals Balinale rejection um t rejected said, "I'm starting to think, okay, maybe this is not good film as you know,
as good as I think it is."
Yeah. And funny, you know, like we edited for a year
and and went through every emotion with that film.

25:46
The days I hated it, the days I loved it.
And so, and and I never really had, you know, TV, you don't really get to see what people feel after.
So, I didn't know how receiving a film feels like or looks like. And so I just know I did my best. So I don't know if it's good or not.
I like what I've come finally put out, but I don't know.
And so the first day of premiere, so Daban Film Festival takes us in and happens in July.
Yes.
And this is the first time I think it hits me. What year is this?
This is 2012. Okay. Um, we shot in 2010 October, edited the whole year, 2011. and then 2012.
Okay. Um, cinema packed.
Mhm. We even have to give up our seats.
Yes.
So, there's some sort of a buzz in the beginning. Not big, just small buzz of there's something interesting from Kenya.

26:53
Mhm.
And Tom, the big director is also around. So they that he's backed it up and you know um and so now the cinema is packed and so we we we I'm sitting at the back. I remember with Tom and this is when it hits me.
Oh my god, this is like 300 400 people now watching my what I did. It's now there. It's now you're naked.
Yeah. you know, and I remember thinking I I want to go outside, but then I can't.
And so when you when you see what Alfred Hitcock used to do, walk in and out of a cinema, you know, like
you you understand it as a director, cuz now it's like your soul is open.
Yes.
For people to now look at you and judge you.
And judge. Yeah.
Yeah. Um, and so I remember shinking in the in my chair and being very quiet and the movie starts and as it goes there's the initial silence and then they start to react how you expect them to react. When I think okay you should laugh here they laugh you know when they think they should uh be they go like you know and so it becomes like an orchestra you know.

28:08
Mhm. And I'm like, "Okay." So, I'm starting to be like, "Okay, it's okay. It's okay." And when the movie ends, the the standing ovation really
and the drama after that now,
oh my god, everybody wants to meet with this young director. They're coming at you from all angles. You have to smile. You have to, you know, you've never been there. You're in the lights, man.
You've never se Yeah.
It's overwhelming. And so we usually get two screenings. Now the second screening now the buzz went out.
Now the guys of the first screening have gone out and people talk
you know and now the the drama started you know second film we couldn't even get seats packed to the bream. Um festival directors emails started flying you know now every festival once and for a year it became madness. as on the move for a year

29:09
just going to festivals
just going to festivals you know
so how does this world for a layman like me how does this world of festivals work
so you launch a movie then you try and get it into a festival but what what's the commercials behind that
about it's it's about awareness it's almost like
you can't
you can you can put money behind advertising okay Hollywood probably is the only place that I need even the festival Yes, they marketing budgets are so high, but not everybody can afford that.
So, festivals help spread across the world because it's where
the world comes into one place.
The the the industry,
the world,
the whole world
Yeah. comes into one place to see.

29:52
You have a representative from Italy, you have a representative from Brazil, you know, they're coming in to see what's out there.
So, it's more manageable. Yes. you know and then when they leave
they they go back knowing what they have seen they could or they can buy for their market.
So festivals are important in that they spread
they spread the world the the word for
filmmakers and especially independent filmmakers cannot afford
okay
$100 million marketing you know
budgets. Yeah.
Yeah.
So you start doing the festival circuit now after Dan.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Festival. Um did German tour for a month. Um just drove around with the film.
Mhm.
Austria. Um Venice. There's nowhere we didn't go. Um LA won award. I won uh breakthrough director there. Okay.

30:48
From AFI which is a prestigious award.
Yes.
Um the film also won audience award. Um to date I think Nairobi Halfife has almost like 40 awards.
Wow.
Yeah.
Wow.
Across.
It really was something man. It really was something. So after you finish now you have done this the Nairobi halfife you um you have to now continue
with life. Yes.
With life you know life life has happened. This was a great thing. The market has received it well
then.
So so luckily I've always been a realist. M um so I quickly understood the life of an independent filmmaker at the time can be brutal. It means you're writing and pitching for like 5 years.
Mhm.
Then you make a movie then you go the festival and then you pitch and another five. I was like

31:43
that's crazy. I'm not built that way. I'm not
um there must be another way. And so me, Easy, and Leama set up a company uh called Film Crew in Africa.
Mhm.
And we we were like we want to work as as production.
Yes.
In fact, film crew, we started by easy. The idea behind it was to be an agency for crew. That's why it was called film crew in Africa.
Okay. Um but then we changed we saw a gap um whereby we we could do um local work small jobs and you know get to do something for ourselves.
So small jobs being like what like advertisements
small advertise you know that advertising was for big foreign directors.
Yes. Yes. Yes.
So the ones that cannot afford to bring those big you know big guys we are happy to do

32:40
to do. Yeah.
Yeah. So that's how we we were thinking at the time. Okay.
But then as fate would have it, the first job we got was a big Coca-Cola job.
Okay.
Um which is another story of the pain we went through because we were young company, young people and big job. I think it was like 50 million and we had like two two G's in our account. You you have no working capital
and we've been asked for guarantee. You've been a working capital.
Yeah. And we've been asked for guarantee. No. No. You know they they pay 50%.
Yes.
To start the job.
But now we they were shu. So
you guess
Yeah. We were young like and and how big this big contract we laying do you know.
So they were like give us a guarantee of half the money. I didn't even know what a guarantee meant at the time.

33:42
Mhm.
So like okay fine whatever it is we will get. Um and and this was stories. So how this even came about this Jason Bratton amazing creative um uh from Australia still lives here.
Yes.
Um I went to him now this is before. I said, "I want to shoot adverts."
And he told me, "Um, okay. What's your show?" Like, I said, "What showing?" He's like, "Um, the work you've seen we've done before." And I'm like, "I have not shot an ad. I want to shoot an ad now. You know, I can shoot. I know I can shoot."
But then he's like, "It doesn't work like that. I need to see if I can trust that you're going to."
So, I said, "Okay, fine." I went and did the same thing I did. Um, I was still shooting change changes that time.

34:31
You did the same thing you did for the application. came up with three adverts. Um, one I shot with Pier McKenna. Um, like a party. Then, uh, with my cousins, my cousins, we made a party.
Uh, another one I shot with, um, uh, Jimmy G.
Yes.
Nes Cafe.
Yes.
And another one with my wife.
Yes.
Then in the bathtub, like a a soap thingy.
Yes.
Edited them. went back to
you went back to your guy.
Went back. I said, "Here they are." She wanted ads here. I I shot this on.
She looked at me, laughed, and said, "Okay." And so he gave me the first job. I think was NIC. NIC. They were doing um the first uh what they call it IPO.
Yes.
Um small, not much risk. That's how the relationship with Jason came about.

35:30
Okay. Uh and then our coke is like he's doing this coke and he's like I'm looking for like a documentary style director. Do you think you guys can? I say yeah we'll pitch we'll try. So I taken you back a bit to understand. Yeah. So now I've been asked for guarantee.
So yeah we pitched for this big job and we got it.
Um and now we have to give a guarantee. We've gone to banks.
Banks are like who are you? But uh you know but the the the PO was good from Scannard big company.
Uh and the job was for Coke big company.
Yes.
And so we're getting an ear and so we we've been getting nos. I went to my uncle took me to one of his uh branches in equity. Yes.
Met the manager there. Ladama went to NCBA easy went to family. We were like trying everywhere we could and NCBA at the time uh there was a a a manager there who will forever be grateful. He's like we there were thresholds that we needed to get to uh but we we hadn't got into.

36:43
Mhm.
But then he looked at the whole thing. He said I mean they're young but if they pulling this kind of um an LPO now
Yes. Yes. What is where they potential? Where are they going? Yes.
And he told us, I'm going to take a risk with you guys.
Um and I'll give you the guarantee.
Yeah.
But I'm taking a risk. I shouldn't I shouldn't be giving.
And that's again how we got a break
and from there we
went and did that job.
Um the best ability. You know what I like to and I don't know if you know this yourself but I believe that there's a lot of power in local context. Yeah. So in more mature markets Yeah. an independent filmmaker is probably an independent filmmaker.

37:32
Yeah. A director is probably a director.
But in our context it's not that you become. So you what I like about that and that's why I like to tell these stories about what we're doing or what various African entrepreneurs are doing is because you've taken your mark, you've taken this skill set that you've learned. Yeah.
And you've taken the market as it is.
You know, I can't just say I'm a filmmaker.
Like I like what you said when you said you're a realist
cuz you now say this is how my market is and I'll adapt to the market. I'll shoot some commercials.
Yeah. And then so does film crew in Africa then lead you to primary picture?
Yeah.
Okay.
So so we end up doing for a decade commercials. Commercials. Commercials.

38:14
Yes.
But then I start feeling like I'm losing
your film side.
My film side.
Yeah.
And
I don't want to lose that.
Um and so I part ways with my partners because of that. I'm like, let me go set up something else so I can just focus also on my film because I feel I've lost it.
Yes.
Um and yeah, so they they understood and and we parted ways and so set up Primary Picture 2018 and and did my first film.
Okay.
Disconnect.
Yes. Uh again again because of the power of of understanding that you got to start something. I I do I break things down. So I say to make a film you need a lot of elements.
Yes.
If I say um I'm going to wait until I get the money to make the film. You'll never do anything.

39:09
Yes.
So what can be done now?
Can we brainstorm the idea? M
all we need is um uh crisps and juice and and 3 days or 4 days of our time.
Can we do that?
We start with that and then we have an idea.
Then you say, "Okay, we need to write a script. How much does it cost?"
Okay. Um uh can I pay you half to start as I look for the other half? So I I went that way until I had a script cuz now I'm like, "Okay, I have a script.
Now it's about making it." And now I didn't have money.
But then I I was I was eating and I went ahead and and and hired people and had a meeting. I remember the first pre-production meeting. I didn't have a scent. But we having pre-production meeting.

40:01
Yeah.
Um and so I paid through that film bit by bit. Like
when I got director fees for shooting a commercial, it went
comments at that time. he went there and and that's how I ended up
um
making the film.
I tell people till today from that I've made Disconnect, Disconnect 2, volume um and another uh inside job just the other day. All these films have never had a line item for me for paying me.
Wow.
I've never been paid as a director or a creator or a producer. I've been there from the beginning to the end of each of them. Some of them volume has almost sent me to the hospital.
Yes.
But never been like a direct payment from those jobs. And I tell someone I was telling and they couldn't believe. But I said but all of them have led to each other.

41:02
All of them have built what I've become. All of them have opened all the doors. You know, I've gotten many jobs because of someone seeing disconnect.
Yes.
Or seeing volume.
Yeah.
So that is my payment.
Wow.
And I remember this person looking at me
trying to understand. So I said it's not about the line item
collectively.
Yes.
And I don't want to mention numbers.
You you look at the collective money.
You're a big You're a forest guy. You're not a tree guy. You're a girl of the forest.
Collectively the money has gone into these projects and you remember that it started with zero.
Yes.
Then you you're like okay that's amazing. So now Tosh you've become a veteran you know from am I

41:52
from that 19year-old who's in your aunties production and interning and learning you're now you're now a you've been around you know you understand the names in the industry you throw them up and down because you are a veteran of the industry
so where do you think we're going
what what is our potential have we just scratched the surface are we where are we are we like 50% % there as a as an as a country and a continent for the first time. I feel there's a lot of confusion.
Mhm.
Cuz the world is moving too fast. Now AI has come.
We don't know whether it will take over or not. Um
but in terms of telling stories, we have never even scratched the surface.
I mean just look at Kenya alone.

42:39
Yes.
We have 44 tribes, communities
with each and all these communities have their own history. Yes.
Um story heroing stories that have not been told you know
and so we haven't scratched the surface in terms of storytelling.
Um but the biggest confusion for us now is the distribution. The problem is the distribution. How do we yeah you know how how to distribute you know and I keep saying there's a lot of support in in skill building which is good you know everybody wants to train the next young kids to come and do but I'm like okay yes we're training them but where are they going where will they go you know
we are not fixing that part that is a problem which is a distribution

43:28
yes
and for me I feel somebody also should just think about spending money on distribution channels
and do a physibility study of how this
cycle can work. How can we build a distribution channel for African content
so that even as we train there's the ark closes.
Yes.
Cuz that's the loop is incomplete and we keep training more and more to go where
um and I feel that's
we we need to we adapted the Hollywood style in everything. doesn't work for this continent
in terms of how we make the films
in terms of distribution.
We can't compare. We don't have the number of cinemas America has.
Um we can't afford to have like the cinema you go to here in in Westgate for everybody.

44:19
Yes.
How can we
look at this carefully because we're the question of watching is not there's no question
not a problem.
People are watching.
Yes. You know,
how do we get to them
at a at a price they can afford, accessibility that they can get to?
Those are can we do a can somebody pay for a physibility study and proper one and then give it to us and say this is the route. Wow, Josh, first of all, for me who's known you for a while, it's been great to hear this story. Yeah. Um, and I think you're on the right um I think we're you're that those are the right questions
and I hope forum like this or or podcast like this when you you you bring out these big questions that need to be asked.

45:05
Let's hope and pray someone hears somewhere and we continue telling our stories but mine is one to give you your flowers. I I really do enjoy your content from Nairobi Halfife. That was my first, but I've been a big fan
and I think I speak for many.
Um, I like what you do. I've also seen you at work through, of course, my wife who's in brand and marketing and I shot several commercials with you.
So, mine is to thank you. Uh, ladies and gentlemen, that was episode 27, Tosh Gonga, Primary Picture. You can check them out. Primary picture.co.ke is the website. uh and uh corporates out there, if you need your work done, give them a call. And uh yeah, uh thank you very much and we look forward to having you on the next episode. Thank you very much.

45:56
Thank you very much. [Music]